Here it is with my larger 1:300 version. I tried this scale but realized the larger ships were just too large. At 1:600 this ship would be about 2.5 inches. This is the largest ship on Lake Ontario until the end of 1813. All American ships seem to have been razed (no quarter deck, forecastle or poop deck) and since the British seemed to copy them near the end of the war it seems may have been a better design. The 1:300 has 1/8 wooden dowel masts and the 1:450 has masts made from barbecue skewers that are around 3/32. I also have craft sticks that are 1/16 but they are only 7 cm. they will be my masts for smaller vessels.
Here is the USS Pike beside the future USS New Orleans. To make this ship the right scale I have enlarged the first rater ship an additional 10% more than the other ships. The British will have 3 first raters and the Americans 2 for my 1815 "What If?" Scenarios. Each side will have an additional 3 or 4 4th and 5th rate ships but the American ships tended to be larger. In 1815 the British were getting a more competent and aggressive admiral than Yeo.
I'm starting off with the 1813 fleets on Lake Ontario. Basically 10 American ships to 6 British. The British were usually outgunned in every lake up until the end of 1814.
Outgunned and above all out-built. The war ended with 3 British frigates and a first-rate, and two frigate "kits" waiting at Montreal that were eventually sold off. But assuming the war had gone on they would likely have been built rather than that third frigate, resulting in 4 frigates total. But the Americans could react faster. I doubt, if things had gone on and they could have afforded it, that the first-rates situation would have remained 3-2 for very long!
ReplyDeleteBut even the Great Lakes would have run out of room eventually. :P
Another thing to consider, and this gets brought up with the blue water ships but not so much the Lakes, is that the American crews were all volunteer. No impressment. That didn't necessarily make for better sailors, but it generally made for happier ones. The Provincial Marine that had run things on the Great Lakes for the British was replaced by the Royal Navy in 1813 anyway, but still, it's an additional factor to consider for the "what-if" scenarios.
Loving your ships so far! The masts look like a great choice.
Good points Reston. The British ships on Lake Ontario were made with better wood and had fewer shortcuts than their American counterparts from 1813 onwards.
ReplyDeleteYeo seems to have been a competent but overly cautious commander. It's hard to fault him however since Upper Canada would have fallen if his fleet was destroyed. A more aggressive, and presumably better commander was coming however.
The British navy was basically a form of slavery. They did have a battalion of Royal Marines, which I would rate as elite, on the Lake Ontario fleet.
The British had been outbuilt on Lake Erie (they considered South Western Upper Canada expendable compared to Eastern Upper Canada), but would have been a close match for the Americans on Ontario if the Brock had not been burned at York.as it was they were ahead by the end of 1814, and looking st the ships both sides were building they were staying ahead, if just slightly.
I think 1815 would have been decisive one way or another. I'm looking forward to trying it out at any rate!
I think, and this is purely my impression, Yeo was only overly cautious but also just plain proud of his fleet. After all, he was the only man in the entire Royal Navy with a lake squadron. It wasn't exactly a prestigious station, but it was a unique one. And he had some fairly unique ships, as well.
ReplyDeleteOwen, his replacement, I don't think, would have concentrated so much on building, but he was also very famously a scientific sailor. Once he arrived (and the war ended) he made many surveys on the Lakes.
Another thing to consider with any 1815 campaign is that the war in Europe was over. If the War of 1812 HAD gone on, England could have gotten very, very aggressive. I don't necessarily think they would have, I think the country was too tired of war. But it is a possibility. Despite not much really being accomplished, the war, as it was, did very well by America and what would be Canada. A longer war may not have. But those sorts of considerations are more for alt-history fiction than the gaming table!
I have never heard of any British plans for 1815, though I know the Americans had plans to invade either towards Montreal or Kingston. They had consolidated the right and left divisions in the fall so were preparing for their next step.
DeleteBoth Naval commanders were cautious when they thought the other had the advantage. Neither side could afford to lose their fleets, especially the British. Both sides blockaded the other hoping for a fight when they had the advantage.
I have never been an alternate history fan, but I do like "What Ifs" based on known plans and forces. Our second battle of Chippawa was our decisive battle; the Americans took the Niagara in our scenario.
I would imagine that in 1815 the British would have consolidated their forces and attempted to occupy Vermont and New Hampshire again. As it was, they ended the war in possession of Maine, both sides of the Niagara, parts of Michigan and Fort Bowyer. The Americans for their part had made peace / defeated the native groups where they wanted to expand and had driven off the 5000 or so English settlers from South Western Ontario / Upper Canada.